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June 3, 2009 at 1:35 am #151420Jedi_PhoenixModerator
Lol, a reminder I needed. I don’t know why I always forget that story! But thanks everyone for your inputs, and I love the diversity of answers. And also the fact that it wasn’t all just “forgive others yada yada yada”
I truly appreciate the input and I think tomorrow I will be prepared to take the next step of my Ninja Journey
PhoenixJune 3, 2009 at 2:42 pm #151427Brandel ValicoParticipant
hmm… Forgiveness… I suppose I fall under the category of those who feel that the need to forgive is usually do to a failing in oneself. Not in that you are willing to forgive. But in the fact that you took the other persons actions so to heart that you were upset and or offended enough by them that you allowed them to dictate your thoughts and perhaps actions to the point you now bear that issue with you to the degree that you feel that you must give the forgiveness.
“There is no offense given were none is taken”
While I often have to seek forgiveness due to others taking offense at my words or actions. I very rarely if ever anymore have to give it. Simply because I very rarely if ever am offended or upset by others actions or words that I take it personally. Instead I simply seek to understand what caused them to say or do what they did. Understand why it may cause myself and others to respond negatively to it. Then often enough with doing so I am able to simply let go of the issue. When I’m unable to, I study why I am so affected by it that I can’t and decide if my attachment to whatever personal issue it is within me is valid. More often then not it isn’t really valid though I have often convinced myself that it was. In which case you let go of that attachment. On the occasion that it is valid and thus I have taken offense to the point I might need to seek forgiveness. I am still aware of the fact that the other person views the situation far differently and from a perspective I do not. That for them their views are as valid as my own. As such I need to weigh the validity of the two views based upon the guiding principles I choose to apply. (For myself that is the Jedi Path’s Principles) If by those completely chosen by me principles I am in the wrong. Then and only then do I ask forgiveness. If I’m not then I simply forget the issue and move on.
The key to doing this quickly and smoothly is time and practice. It used to take me months to work through issues that now take seconds. Simply because I know myself and my triggers.
For example : I have a pet peeve concerning Judas and the betrayal of Christ story.
Now a knee jerk reaction in me was initiated by Shawn in his post below.Quote:Jesus was betrayed by one of His closet Followers and then mocked by others which then led to crucifixion and death but what did He say on the Cross before He died?
I instantly deduced (read drew connections that are unfounded as I never sought evidence to the validity or falseness of my “deductions”) that he meant Judas. (He may not have) and due to my pet peeve of the logic that you can’t betray someone who knows what your doing and in fact (fact used here solely in the context that the Bible says it happened) tells you to go and do exactly what you did before you go and do it. So now we apply the method above.
First did Shawn mean to offend me? Nope, very doubtful. He simply was sharing his beliefs. Nor was he aware of my pet peeve.
Second Was offense taken on either side? Hopefully Shawn won’t be offended by me using him and his beliefs in this example. For my own part I wasn’t offended by him, my pet peeve is against what I consider bad logic. Not him personally.
Now for the most part having figured out that my issue wasn’t with him but that of the logic involved. I can let go of any emotional attachment and look at the validity within myself of if my views of the issue that pushes my button are valid or not and if they are big enough to cause me to argue them publicly or not (at one time I would have torn into poor Shawn simply for expressing his beliefs. In an attempt to sway him to my views). Now I let such issues go. Bringing it up here simply to show an actual usage of the concepts. Now should after a careful consideration once again of the issue. I feel my view on it is wrong then I change my view and if need be (in the case that the other person was offended) ask forgiveness. (In the case they weren’t then there is no need to do so) I also usually thank them for offering me a new insight. Now should my views still hold validity (again it is important to note here that the validity is decided by for myself by my own set of criteria. As it is by others using their own. As such what I consider as valid may not be by others. It’s also very important to except that they aren’t wrong to do so.) then I stand by them.
To sum up, for myself the keys are to let go of the emotional attachment and approach it peacefully. To try and understand all sides of it and gain as much insight and knowledge as I can about all sides of the issue.This includes understanding the emotions and feelings the issue raises in all sides. So I’m not allowing my ignorance to guide me. Then I make sure I’m not so passionate about my own views on the subject that it clouds my judgment and approach it from a serene position. Then act accordingly. I also accept that by doing so I am directly interacting and perhaps altering the flow of the issue or issues. Since even observation alone does this.
Now if those keys should look familiar.
Either way I hope this helps you with the study of forgiveness.June 5, 2009 at 4:40 am #151446Magdelene NashiraParticipant
I think probably the thing that taught me how important forgiveness is was the many times I have been on the receiving end of it. The times when I have felt a need to be forgiven and was. The times when I was forgiven by people, who later told me, and I hadn’t realized they were even mad. And most impressively when I became spiritually aware of God and the depth of His forgiveness for me personally in situations which I would not likely even forgive myself. So I realized the importance and need for it.
The thing that taught me that it is important to forgive others is when the Holy Spirit brought to my attention that if I demanded perfection of other people I should be willing to accept that I have to be as perfect as I expect them to be in order to be fair. With the logical realization that I don’t even live up to my own standards at times, I realized that perhaps I ought to let go of my expectations that other people would be perfect. It stands to reason that if I am a human being and am not perfect that others who are human beings are also not going to be perfect. So unless I wanted to continue to exist on an island all by myself, I had better learn to forgive as well as accepting the forgiveness of others.
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