Star Wars, Episode 7, The Force Awakens

  • Tothian
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Tothian created the topic: Star Wars, Episode 7, The Force Awakens

Here i make this for anyone who wants to discuss episode 7. Brilliantly done. Was a little disappointed the books were no longer the legit thing, and the movie undid it. However I like the twist of things.

Kylo Ren was the coolest badguy, seemed more badass in beginning when some of us thought it could be Luke, like mirroring Vader and all. But still interesting how his story happened.

While it would have been cool to see more of Luke, I still enjoyed the story of it.

I like how so far, each 1st of the trilogies mirrored. Ep1, the Jedi Master dies, Ep4 the Jedi Master and wise experienced old General dies, Ep7 the experienced old General dies. All by lightsaber.

Rey mirrors Anakin and Luke. And in some ways Princess Leia.

bb8 is awesome.

Odd seeing the one the world has known for 4 decades as Princess Leia as General Leia. But, in the books she was Senator Leia Organa Solo.

I was glad Poe Dameron survived because it made things interesting and felt right.
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  • Nova Starfire
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Nova Starfire replied the topic: Star Wars, Episode 7, The Force Awakens

Tothian, although I respect your opinion, I have to disagree. I thought Episode Seven was atrocious. I have been reading the books since I was a kid, and have even had the pleasure of meeting Timothy Zahn, Michael Stackpole, and Kevin J. Anderson at a writing workshop. The amount of time and effort that has been put forward by these men, and other authors of Star Wars literature, is just incredible. They have to get approval for everything that they have ever put forward. Everything that has ever been written about the Star Wars universe, including the Jedi Path, has taken it's facts from the EU that has been laid out for us in the novels. I know that it isn't technically canon, but it has been accepted as such for many years. But now, not only has JJ Abrams given all of the devoted readers of the literature a huge middle finger, he has also done it to every author of every novel that has ever been written about Star Wars. He basically has said that nothing these people have written is good enough, and that he is going to do whatever the hell he wants. It's infuriating. I would understand if he had just chosen one story to follow, such as the Hand of Thrawn series, since there is so much to work with, or he had changed certain minor details, but that isn't what he did. He just obliterated everything and made up his own story, which wasn't even very good.

The worst part is that now his mediocre crap WILL be canon, while my bookshelf (and many others, I suspect), is now full of books that are going to be considered nothing more than fan fiction. Zahn, Stackpole, and Anderson will now no longer be relevant, except as an interesting footnote in Star Wars history.

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  • David (Phoenix)
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David (Phoenix) replied the topic: Star Wars, Episode 7, The Force Awakens

While I am equally saddened by the expulsion of EU into legend, I wanted to make sure that some facts were stated (still trying to find sources for everything, but this is what I know so far....maybe Kol has sources, he tends to be way better at that then me):

1) It was not J.J. Abrams who trashed the EU. Rather I believe it was Disney and the new head of Lucasfilms, LTD. Abrams, at that point, was just following direction.
2) The EU tended to contradict itself, was not as well-regulated as believed, and as you said, was read by Star Wars enthusiasts...which leads to point #3
3) Disney wanted to make sure that everything added up. The easiest way to do that was to scrap the old story line and start fresh. They wanted there to be new surprises and new adventures that people couldn't easily predict for the new movies.
4) (semi-fact) Lucas only considered the 6 movies cannon and nothing else.
----
That all being said, that is not my opinion on the matter, just what various press releases, media articles, etc have stated that I believe to be fact. I am sad, in particular, that Admiral Thrawn was thrown out, as that is by far my favorite EU series. And, I think, personally, that it had to do with the age of the original three actors. I mean, Luke didn't even have a line in the first movie. JJ was trying to get him to lose weight before the movie so that he could be "more grand master-ish". Harrison Ford stated in one interview that he wanted Han killed off in Episode 6....lol. So, I have a feeling some of the change in direction and light action by the original characters was due to simple human flaws and the need to create a series that would support the age the original characters were in.

"...who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. " ~ Theodore Roosevelt
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  • Nova Starfire
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Nova Starfire replied the topic: Star Wars, Episode 7, The Force Awakens

I understand that the actors are older, but there were some things that could have been done with that. I mean, if they were going to make a whole story about Han and Leia having an evil kid who was following on the path of Vader, why not just use the actual story? Jacen was evil. They could have used the New Jedi Knights series as a starting point. I think the Yuuzhan Vong war would have been perfect here. I know that the EU wasn't perfect (Crystal Star comes to mind....ugh), but I thought it was as rich and great a universe as you could possibly want.

I know that Episode Seven isn't canon, I just mean that now no one is ever going to give the EU a second glance. No one who is new to the Star Wars universe will even bother to read any of the books now, because it's "legend". It's just sad.

"The soul becomes dyed with the color of its thoughts"

-Marcus Aurelius
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Jax replied the topic: Re:Star Wars, Episode 7, The Force Awakens

I wish they had used the Jacen storyline too. But since it's too late I choose to enjoy what they did and appreciate the good parts. Rey is the most exciting character in Star Wars for me. Little girls have a real hero to emulate who actually physically kicks ass. I will take that over yet another male lead any day.


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  • Kol Drake
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Kol Drake replied the topic: Re:Star Wars, Episode 7, The Force Awakens

While an entire generation was inspired by the sights, sounds, 'feel' and music of the original trilogy, I do not get the impression #7 inspired much of anyone. Yes, some folks want to make 'real' BB-8s. I can understand that; rolling ball bots are cool. But there is not the 'zing' that came from the original trilogy -- the wonder -- the excitement. Now, I get the impression everyone is more thinking -- "maybe #8 will do it..."

I agree with the many who wish they had not trashed the EU. For all it's flaws, there were some good stories and characters within it. Even the 'side stories' -- X-Wing Squadron and the Bounty Hunter / Mandalorian armor series were not bad.

Instead, we got a semi retconn of #4 and #5 with a female lead instead of a male lead. Kylo as 'the Anakin we didn't get' from the prequel trilogy. And so much mangled presentations of the Force I can't stand to count them all. Perhaps the novelization of #7 has more scenes and bits which help make it all 'better'... but they sure weren't in the movie.

It wasn't totally 'bad' as a 'go watch for fun' movie but, it was not anywhere near the original trilogy imo.
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Jax replied the topic: Re:Star Wars, Episode 7, The Force Awakens

You can't recreate that magic though. The movie brought the Force for the first time. There's no way to go back to a time when we didn't know the Force.


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  • Kol Drake
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Kol Drake replied the topic: Re:Star Wars, Episode 7, The Force Awakens

And yet... I get a chill up my spine watching the just released trailer for "Rogue One" due out in Decemeber.

I'm not asking /seeking the same 'magic' as the originals.
I DO expect a decent story which reflects the history of 'a galaxy far far away'.
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Jax replied the topic: Re:Star Wars, Episode 7, The Force Awakens

I am waiting to see what episode 8 brings. That's the more critical one to me.


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